Summer of code idea: make tiny game demos to expose problems in Wine
I've just added http://wiki.winehq.org/SummerOfCode#head-5cdc861e4369f94f0af19d09710d33d76b1... Current text: "Big games are hard to debug. Small demo games show interesting problems in Wine (see e.g. http://bugs.winehq.org/buglist.cgi?quicksearch=3drad ) There are lots of tools (see http://wiki.winehq.org/GameEngines ) that make developing tiny games easy Let's try making the smallest possible demo games that show problems in Wine, and file bugs for what we find (along with the source for the games/demos)." Anyone want to help mentor?
On Sun, 21 Feb 2010, Dan Kegel wrote:
I've just added http://wiki.winehq.org/SummerOfCode#head-5cdc861e4369f94f0af19d09710d33d76b1... Current text: "Big games are hard to debug. Small demo games show interesting problems in Wine (see e.g. http://bugs.winehq.org/buglist.cgi?quicksearch=3drad ) There are lots of tools (see http://wiki.winehq.org/GameEngines ) that make developing tiny games easy Let's try making the smallest possible demo games that show problems in Wine, and file bugs for what we find (along with the source for the games/demos)."
This does not seem related to Wine to me, except in a very round-about way. IMHO a better way would be to improve the conformance tests as running them is already automated and they are even clearer about what is being tested. -- Francois Gouget <fgouget(a)free.fr> http://fgouget.free.fr/ "Lotto: A tax on people who are bad at math." -- unknown "Windows: Microsoft's tax on computer illiterates." -- WE7U
On Tue, Feb 23, 2010 at 2:29 PM, Francois Gouget <fgouget(a)free.fr> wrote:
On Sun, 21 Feb 2010, Dan Kegel wrote:
I've just added http://wiki.winehq.org/SummerOfCode#head-5cdc861e4369f94f0af19d09710d33d76b1... Current text: "Big games are hard to debug. Small demo games show interesting problems in Wine (see e.g. http://bugs.winehq.org/buglist.cgi?quicksearch=3drad ) There are lots of tools (see http://wiki.winehq.org/GameEngines ) that make developing tiny games easy Let's try making the smallest possible demo games that show problems in Wine, and file bugs for what we find (along with the source for the games/demos)."
This does not seem related to Wine to me, except in a very round-about way. IMHO a better way would be to improve the conformance tests as running them is already automated and they are even clearer about what is being tested.
I'm also not convinced about this project. Something better (although I'm not sure if that would really belong in Wine either) is some sort of performance measuring framework. In case of 3d stuff, Nvidia (and others as well) has a tool called nvperfhud. It can provide detailed information on how busy certain stages of the gpu are. Perhaps it is useful to integrate something like that into Wine. Or perhaps create something more generic e.g. some 'wrapper' around windows dlls which we can use to profile Windows apps and Wine apps, so that we can compare performance. Roderick
Tirsdag 23 februar 2010 14:51:09 skrev Roderick Colenbrander :
On Tue, Feb 23, 2010 at 2:29 PM, Francois Gouget <fgouget(a)free.fr> wrote:
On Sun, 21 Feb 2010, Dan Kegel wrote:
I've just added http://wiki.winehq.org/SummerOfCode#head-5cdc861e4369f94f0af19d09710d33d 76b1f5c64 Current text: "Big games are hard to debug. Small demo games show interesting problems in Wine (see e.g. http://bugs.winehq.org/buglist.cgi?quicksearch=3drad ) There are lots of tools (see http://wiki.winehq.org/GameEngines ) that make developing tiny games easy Let's try making the smallest possible demo games that show problems in Wine, and file bugs for what we find (along with the source for the games/demos)."
This does not seem related to Wine to me, except in a very round-about way. IMHO a better way would be to improve the conformance tests as running them is already automated and they are even clearer about what is being tested.
I'm also not convinced about this project. Something better (although I'm not sure if that would really belong in Wine either) is some sort of performance measuring framework. In case of 3d stuff, Nvidia (and others as well) has a tool called nvperfhud. It can provide detailed information on how busy certain stages of the gpu are. Perhaps it is useful to integrate something like that into Wine. Or perhaps create something more generic e.g. some 'wrapper' around windows dlls which we can use to profile Windows apps and Wine apps, so that we can compare performance.
Roderick
Maybe someone can work on implementing dxdiag.exe in Wine? We could add some extra tests compared to the Windows versions, and the small games could be a part of that. Alexander N. Sørnes
Alexander Nicolaysen Sørnes wrote:
Maybe someone can work on implementing dxdiag.exe in Wine? We could add some extra tests compared to the Windows versions, and the small games could be a part of that.
I'd say Wine's dxdiag should mainly run the existing DirectX tests and report any failure to the user. This may also help with making the current (graphics) driver bugs Wine is hitting with more prominent.
2010/2/23 Alexander Nicolaysen Sørnes <alex(a)thehandofagony.com>:
Maybe someone can work on implementing dxdiag.exe in Wine? We could add some extra tests compared to the Windows versions, and the small games could be a part of that.
Yeah, I've updated my proposal to mention that possibility, and to refer to http://wiki.winehq.org/SummerOfCode#head-bbaefe0a459986254d1cad93ccc51ef915f... which talks about reviving the improved dxdiag. (Although I've been told since that AJ frowns on people reviving other people's dead code?) - Dan
On Tue, Feb 23, 2010 at 5:29 AM, Francois Gouget <fgouget(a)free.fr> wrote:
http://wiki.winehq.org/SummerOfCode#head-5cdc861e4369f94f0af19d09710d33d76b1... Current text: ... Let's try making the smallest possible demo games that show problems in Wine, and file bugs for what we find (along with the source for the games/demos)."
This does not seem related to Wine to me, except in a very round-about way. IMHO a better way would be to improve the conformance tests as running them is already automated and they are even clearer about what is being tested.
OK, next draft: http://wiki.winehq.org/SummerOfCode#head-8d0895f237c9c3579ffe4282412bbbf2c8c... Current text: "Direct3D - Conformance / Performance / Interactive tests Possible Mentors: DanKegel Even small demos show interesting problems in Wine (see e.g. http://bugs.winehq.org/buglist.cgi?quicksearch=3drad, http://bugs.winehq.org/show_bug.cgi?id=21817 ) There are lots of tools (see http://wiki.winehq.org/GameEngines ) that make developing tiny games easy; they often come with tutorials or examples that might let you isolate problems We would like to capture the problems these expose by writing conformace tests (possibly WINETEST_INTERACTIVE ones, if they can't be automated) or performance test tools (as part of programs/dxtest, perhaps), or at the very least bug reports It'd be nice to also fix some of the problems, too." Is that closer?
participants (5)
-
Alexander Nicolaysen Sørnes -
Dan Kegel -
Francois Gouget -
Julius Schwartzenberg -
Roderick Colenbrander