[Bug 44406] New: Wine-staging packages haven' t been built since the end of November, 2017
https://bugs.winehq.org/show_bug.cgi?id=44406
Bug ID: 44406 Summary: Wine-staging packages haven't been built since the end of November, 2017 Product: Packaging Version: unspecified Hardware: x86 OS: Linux Status: NEW Severity: normal Priority: P2 Component: wine-packages Assignee: wine-bugs@winehq.org Reporter: dimesio@earthlink.net CC: michael@fds-team.de, sebastian@fds-team.de Distribution: ---
There have been no new wine-staging packages since 2.21, two months ago. Multiple users are asking about it on the forum, especially now that 3.0 is out.
If the branch is being abandoned, we need to inform users of that.
https://bugs.winehq.org/show_bug.cgi?id=44406
Austin English austinenglish@gmail.com changed:
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Robert Walker bob.mt.wya@gmail.com changed:
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Sveinar Søpler cybermax@dexter.no changed:
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--- Comment #1 from Sveinar Søpler cybermax@dexter.no --- I can CONFIRM that wine-staging has not been updated since 22.nov 2017.
PS. I wonder if CERN scientists could use "Bugzilla" to study the effects of black holes? :)
https://bugs.winehq.org/show_bug.cgi?id=44406
Dox IngeniousDox@gmail.com changed:
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--- Comment #2 from Dox IngeniousDox@gmail.com --- A lot of the Golden / Platinum ratings come from the fact that the tests are done on Staging. For example run Blizzard Games, the ntdll patches in Wine Staging are needed. In normal Wine you just get "Game initialization failed" error. So that would just give them garbage rating.
It would be lovely to have an updated Staging. Or if you are going to abandon staging, to mainline those patches into Wine.
But yes, what we really need is information. What is going on? What are the plans etc?
https://bugs.winehq.org/show_bug.cgi?id=44406
Artem turbonomad@gmail.com changed:
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Robert Munteanu robert.munteanu@gmail.com changed:
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kevin01010@gmail.com changed:
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tokktokk fdsfgs@krutt.org changed:
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dubigrasu dubigrasu@yahoo.com changed:
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Paul Gofman gofmanp@gmail.com changed:
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Yar4e kiber_pank4@mail.ru changed:
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Lorenzo Ferrillo lorenzofer@live.it changed:
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--- Comment #3 from Lorenzo Ferrillo lorenzofer@live.it --- I'm particulary worried about DTXn support patches (needed to play without glitches some games)
In wine staging they rely on libtxc_dxtn library that implemented the S3TC compression/decompression alghoritms. (And this allowed distros that don't want to have patented code in the repos, to start package the alternative S2TC algorithms (lower quality but left out of the algorithm the patented part of S3TC) in a way that it was aviable directly in Mesa, despite having a lower quality)
This library was created for allowing users to have S3TC support in Mesa without the patent encoumbered code in Mesa itself.
However now that the patent for S3TC is expired from October the libtxc_dxtn is now included inside Mesa.
Many distributions such Arch Linux started to remove the libtxc_dxtn becouse of this (and the fact that libtxc_dxtn.so was supposed to be an internal mesa-only library).
Unfortunatly the DXtn patches seems to be strictly dependant on two libtxc_dxtn functions. Dunno if it is feasible to do the surface conversions inside the OpenGL pipeline (if GL_EXT_texture_compression_s3tc is supported), or if it is feasible to reimplment the two function inside the d3d9x_36 code. (Henry mentioned the fact that the patches add a d3d9x_*.dll -> wined3d.dll dependancy as one reason of the unfeseability of mainlining this patches)
ArchLinux Bug that caused the removal: https://bugs.archlinux.org/task/56660
https://bugs.winehq.org/show_bug.cgi?id=44406
Bloody Iron bloodyiron@lanified.com changed:
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--- Comment #4 from Bloody Iron bloodyiron@lanified.com --- There are a LOT of games that are suffering because staging isn't out yet. I can't wait to sink my teeth into Overwatch with DX10/11, but I also need full CSMT, so that doesn't really work.
Who was working on it last? As an outsider it's hard to see if ANYONE is doing ANYTHING. And while someone might be doing something, we have no real example of that.
So, if you're someone working on it, please tell the rest of the world what the plan is? That'd be great!
https://bugs.winehq.org/show_bug.cgi?id=44406
--- Comment #5 from Austin English austinenglish@gmail.com --- (In reply to Bloody Iron from comment #4)
Who was working on it last? As an outsider it's hard to see if ANYONE is doing ANYTHING. And while someone might be doing something, we have no real example of that.
As far as I know no one is working on it. The previous maintainers are afk and unresponsive. Again, afaik no one has stepped up to maintain staging either, so anyone skilled and interested should contact wine-devel.
https://bugs.winehq.org/show_bug.cgi?id=44406
--- Comment #6 from Zebediah Figura z.figura12@gmail.com --- (In reply to Austin English from comment #5)
As far as I know no one is working on it. The previous maintainers are afk and unresponsive. Again, afaik no one has stepped up to maintain staging either, so anyone skilled and interested should contact wine-devel.
Alistair seems to have taken up the mantle of at least rebasing the patches:
https://github.com/alesliehughes/wine-staging/
https://bugs.winehq.org/show_bug.cgi?id=44406
Alistair Leslie-Hughes leslie_alistair@hotmail.com changed:
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--- Comment #7 from Alistair Leslie-Hughes leslie_alistair@hotmail.com --- (In reply to Zebediah Figura from comment #6)
(In reply to Austin English from comment #5)
As far as I know no one is working on it. The previous maintainers are afk and unresponsive. Again, afaik no one has stepped up to maintain staging either, so anyone skilled and interested should contact wine-devel.
Alistair seems to have taken up the mantle of at least rebasing the patches:
I have at this stage but it's going to take some time it get in sync with winehq. There are a lot of patches that don't cleanly apply, and working out why is time consuming.
https://bugs.winehq.org/show_bug.cgi?id=44406
Zebediah Figura z.figura12@gmail.com changed:
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--- Comment #8 from Zebediah Figura z.figura12@gmail.com --- (In reply to Alistair Leslie-Hughes from comment #7)
I have at this stage but it's going to take some time it get in sync with winehq. There are a lot of patches that don't cleanly apply, and working out why is time consuming.
If you'd like some assistance, I'd be willing to offer what help I can in that respect.
https://bugs.winehq.org/show_bug.cgi?id=44406
--- Comment #9 from Dox IngeniousDox@gmail.com --- On Discord, there are people in LGG (Linux Gamer Group) and VKX (vk9/dxvk) server that are doing the same. I'm going to assume there are more places that people started doing this.
That just underscores that it really time for WineDevs (Staging Devs), to give infomation about what is going. And if they can use help, perhaps find a way for these volunteers to actually help on staging, instead of their own forks.
https://bugs.winehq.org/show_bug.cgi?id=44406
--- Comment #10 from Bloody Iron bloodyiron@lanified.com --- (In reply to Alistair Leslie-Hughes from comment #7)
(In reply to Zebediah Figura from comment #6)
(In reply to Austin English from comment #5)
As far as I know no one is working on it. The previous maintainers are afk and unresponsive. Again, afaik no one has stepped up to maintain staging either, so anyone skilled and interested should contact wine-devel.
Alistair seems to have taken up the mantle of at least rebasing the patches:
I have at this stage but it's going to take some time it get in sync with winehq. There are a lot of patches that don't cleanly apply, and working out why is time consuming.
Thanks for your help! We all appreciate it! :D
https://bugs.winehq.org/show_bug.cgi?id=44406
--- Comment #11 from Sveinar Søpler cybermax@dexter.no --- There are enourmous amounts of changes from 2.x -> 3.x, so rebasing wine staging from last-known 2.21 -> 3.1 is a huge undertaking.
If staging should have stayed "alive" in its previous form, this would have been needed to be rebased each git-master i guess, cos the changes from 2.21 -> 3.1 (current dev) is very large.
Its a real shame that none from winehq-dev spits out any public message, cos what is going on now is that there will be 2-3-4+ ppl/groups all doing their own rebases.. possibly to varying degrees.
The documentation on the staging repository is there.. in the history of commits, so if it would be of use, one should cherry pick "important" patches, and get those in. Doing the whole patch-set is... well.. too daunting imo.
Kudos to everyone lending a hand tho! :)
https://bugs.winehq.org/show_bug.cgi?id=44406
--- Comment #12 from Henri Verbeet hverbeet@gmail.com --- (In reply to Sveinar Søpler from comment #11)
Its a real shame that none from winehq-dev spits out any public message, cos what is going on now is that there will be 2-3-4+ ppl/groups all doing their own rebases.. possibly to varying degrees.
If it's any consolation, the Staging people haven't told us anything either. Clearly that's not ideal.
I'd suggest people interested in picking up the Staging patches coordinate on the wine-devel mailing list and the #winehackers IRC channel, but ultimately that's of course up to individual people.
https://bugs.winehq.org/show_bug.cgi?id=44406
Fabian Maurer dark.shadow4@web.de changed:
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Ker noa blue-t@web.de changed:
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Luke Short ekultails@gmail.com changed:
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--- Comment #13 from Luke Short ekultails@gmail.com --- It was expressed a few months ago at WineConf 2017 that, moving forward, the idea is to work on cleaning up the hacky patches from Wine-Staging and get them into the official Wine project faster. If you keep track of the wine-devel mailing list you will already notice that a lot of patches have already been cleaned up and integrated. With the Wine 3.0 release, Alexandre even gave the greenlight to integrate the long-awaited command stream multi-threading (CSMT) patches.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AokFgDSLMWU
https://bugs.winehq.org/show_bug.cgi?id=44406
--- Comment #14 from Zebediah Figura z.figura12@gmail.com --- (In reply to Luke Short from comment #13)
It was expressed a few months ago at WineConf 2017 that, moving forward, the idea is to work on cleaning up the hacky patches from Wine-Staging and get them into the official Wine project faster. If you keep track of the wine-devel mailing list you will already notice that a lot of patches have already been cleaned up and integrated. With the Wine 3.0 release, Alexandre even gave the greenlight to integrate the long-awaited command stream multi-threading (CSMT) patches.
The suggestion was made, and some people (mostly Vincent, more recently also Alistair among others) have been trying to do so. That said, none of the Staging people attended the last conference (and indeed they've been radio-silent since early November, before the conference began), so it's not really the case that the agreed-upon intent is now to get rid of Staging.
https://bugs.winehq.org/show_bug.cgi?id=44406
--- Comment #15 from Alistair Leslie-Hughes leslie_alistair@hotmail.com --- (In reply to Zebediah Figura from comment #14)
The suggestion was made, and some people (mostly Vincent, more recently also Alistair among others) have been trying to do so. That said, none of the Staging people attended the last conference (and indeed they've been radio-silent since early November, before the conference began), so it's not really the case that the agreed-upon intent is now to get rid of Staging.
Here is the new repository for wine-staging. https://github.com/wine-staging/wine-staging
Anybody who has cloned mine, please change to this new one.
https://bugs.winehq.org/show_bug.cgi?id=44406
Daniel Bermond danielbermond@yahoo.com changed:
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--- Comment #16 from Sveinar Søpler cybermax@dexter.no --- (In reply to Zebediah Figura from comment #14)
(In reply to Luke Short from comment #13)
It was expressed a few months ago at WineConf 2017 that, moving forward, the idea is to work on cleaning up the hacky patches from Wine-Staging and get them into the official Wine project faster. If you keep track of the wine-devel mailing list you will already notice that a lot of patches have already been cleaned up and integrated. With the Wine 3.0 release, Alexandre even gave the greenlight to integrate the long-awaited command stream multi-threading (CSMT) patches.
The suggestion was made, and some people (mostly Vincent, more recently also Alistair among others) have been trying to do so. That said, none of the Staging people attended the last conference (and indeed they've been radio-silent since early November, before the conference began), so it's not really the case that the agreed-upon intent is now to get rid of Staging.
"They" (WineHQ and wine-staging) have a webpage. If this was the latest "Lets do it" agreed upon, they should post it.
Having a "we talked about this at WineConf, and if you were not there you are left in the dark" sense to it is kinda.. well.. not what everyone else would deem "customer friendly".
Not informing anyone about anything AT ALL makes for shit relationship with users. If noone bothers using your software, scrap it. If ppl use it cos its the only viable alternative, it still does not make it "ok" to be a asshat :) (Yeah, that was meant to WineHQ devs and wine-staging devs).
https://bugs.winehq.org/show_bug.cgi?id=44406
--- Comment #17 from Michael Müller michael@fds-team.de --- You can find a statement at https://wine-staging.com/news/2018-02-17-future-wine-staging.html
https://bugs.winehq.org/show_bug.cgi?id=44406
--- Comment #18 from Zebediah Figura z.figura12@gmail.com --- (In reply to Sveinar Søpler from comment #16)
(In reply to Zebediah Figura from comment #14)
The suggestion was made, and some people (mostly Vincent, more recently also Alistair among others) have been trying to do so. That said, none of the Staging people attended the last conference (and indeed they've been radio-silent since early November, before the conference began), so it's not really the case that the agreed-upon intent is now to get rid of Staging.
"They" (WineHQ and wine-staging) have a webpage. If this was the latest "Lets do it" agreed upon, they should post it.
Having a "we talked about this at WineConf, and if you were not there you are left in the dark" sense to it is kinda.. well.. not what everyone else would deem "customer friendly".
The point I'm trying to make is that there was no "official decision" here; it was more like Vincent said during a discussion on the state of staging that he'd been trying to move staging patches into upstream and that everyone else should too.
Not informing anyone about anything AT ALL makes for shit relationship with users. If noone bothers using your software, scrap it. If ppl use it cos its the only viable alternative, it still does not make it "ok" to be a asshat :) (Yeah, that was meant to WineHQ devs and wine-staging devs).
Extended radio silence from the Staging folks is not ideal, of course, but it's understandable, especially if they were in some degree of uncertainty themselves as to whether they could continue maintaining the project.
https://bugs.winehq.org/show_bug.cgi?id=44406
Rosanne DiMesio dimesio@earthlink.net changed:
What |Removed |Added ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Status|NEW |RESOLVED Resolution|--- |WONTFIX
--- Comment #19 from Rosanne DiMesio dimesio@earthlink.net --- This bug is specifically about the WineHQ staging packages, not about the future of wine-staging in general, and we now have an answer from the the WineHQ package maintainer.
Marking WONTFIX.
https://bugs.winehq.org/show_bug.cgi?id=44406
Adam Bolte abolte@systemsaviour.com changed:
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Evgenii Burmentev [:virus_found] vir.found@gmail.com changed:
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--- Comment #20 from Sveinar Søpler cybermax@dexter.no --- (In reply to Michael Müller from comment #17)
You can find a statement at https://wine-staging.com/news/2018-02-17-future-wine-staging.html
Atleast we now KNOW the reason and state. Probably easy for me from the sideline to say "i wish you had stated it sooner", but i guess the decision was not a quick one.
Guess i'll be dual-booting when the next wow expansion launces :P
https://bugs.winehq.org/show_bug.cgi?id=44406
ax 34noff otaku@rambler.ru changed:
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tt_1 herrtimson@yahoo.de changed:
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Rosanne DiMesio dimesio@earthlink.net changed:
What |Removed |Added ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Resolution|WONTFIX |FIXED Status|RESOLVED |CLOSED
--- Comment #21 from Rosanne DiMesio dimesio@earthlink.net --- Staging has been revived and packaging resumed since my last comment, so changing the resolution to FIXED.
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