On Mon, Jul 13, 2009 at 9:47 PM, axel_xia@sohu.com wrote:
I am a Chinese user for Fedora and have be trying to use wine for very long time. Based on my experience in wine evaluation, may I provide my suggestions on wine development & prospect?
Yes, please! But please don't cross-post. Your question probably belongs on wine-devel or wine-users. cc'ing five different mailing lists is not a good idea.
- There are many many discussions in the internet about the Chinese font
sets issue in wine (wine very very slow, or can not display Chinese correctly, & etc). However, most popular Linux distributions almost have no issues for Chinese character display nowadays, the Chinese version of $MS windows are perfectly compatible with Chinese character and even all the softwares for $MS windows use default $MS Chinese fonts without any issues. So, is that possible for wine/crossover to directly use/share Chinese fonts (even all fonts of different languages) in linux distributions?
As far as I know, the MS chinese fonts are copyrighted, and their license terms do not permit redistribution. (The "microsoft core fonts" were distributed under a very permissive license, and are more or less available on all linux systems, but they don't have good chinese fonts.) If you know of any legally downloadable chinese fonts, please let me know and I'll at least add them to winetricks.
If you're saying that Linux already comes with great Chinese fonts, and Wine isn't using them properly, then that sounds like a bug we need to fix. There are two bugs open right now for CJK fonts: http://bugs.winehq.org/show_bug.cgi?id=13829 (fonts aren't found properly) http://bugs.winehq.org/show_bug.cgi?id=16325 (fonts don't look good) Perhaps you should file one for the slow fonts issue.
- Is that possible to have someone from winehq.org to verify $MS software
applicable in wine or not(at lease which .dll should be copy into ~./wine/.../system32)? I found thousands of $MS softwares are posted on AppDB in www.winehq.org but only checked by evaluators. So I wonder if possible for winehq.org people to validate these programs and even better to tell visitors step by step to run each software in wine. I think it is better to post the correct steps of $MS software emulation in AppDB because we need to rely on the offical website. It is harmful that users don't think AppDB is believable then less and less people will come to www.winehq.org for help day by day.
Sadly, we don't have enough manpower to keep appdb up to date ourselves; we rely on volunteers. Our goal is for there to be no steps needed beyond running setup and starting the app, so that's what Wine developers tend to spend their time on, and we leave appdb updating to volunteers. That said, it would be helpful for somebody to make a pass over the popular apps in the appdb and update the howtos, including converting ad hoc installation steps into winetricks steps as appropriate. Any volunteers?
- Is that possible to open accounts in Forums of winehq website for common
users? And also is that possible to have different forums in Chinese or in other languages established worldwide?
That's a good idea. We can also link to any other Wine forums that already exist in other languages; do you know of any in Chinese?
Thanks again for writing. We've known for a long time that we have some issues with Asian languages, but since most of our developers are not fluent in Asian languages, we haven't made much progress on it. We rely on feedback like the messages you've been sending lately. - Dan
Hi, Dan, Thanks for your email. And please kindly see my comments below:
Reply to topic 1):It is true that it is not leaglly suitable to copy MS fonts, however the open-source fonts (Wenquanyi, http://wenq.org/enindex.cgi) has been available for very long period, which also are probalble used by Fedora & Ubuntu as default Chinese fonts (even Asian/CJK fonts(maybe CKJ means "Chinese Japanese Korean"), but I am not sure). Please refer to the attached pictures for the Chinese environment in Fedora 10 & Ubuntu 9.04 by only choosing Chinese language when installing Linux OS. In my opinion, I do not think we need to add these Chinese fonts into winetricks, instead, we only need by default in wine to create a link between wine & these fonts of Linux OS, just like the way when $MS softwares are installed into Chinese version of $MS windows: the software itself does not include the fonts, but it will share the fonts in OS when displaying Chinese because the Chinese version of OS already has the Chinese fonts installed. I guess it is the best way for www.winehq.org to work together with Redhat/Fedora & Ubutun & other distributions about the fonts linking to Linux OS.
Reply to topic 2):I understand that few manpower are available in wine-develop group, but what about finding someone to establish &/ take care of the Chinese version in appdb? And then assign someone in wine-devel who understand Chinese to help monitor the Chinese version of appdb or forums. If so, it allows most of Chinese evaluators to post their test into appdb, which will contribute the development of wine really a lot.
And, at least some popular $MS software can be added into winetricks after tests passed, such as Xunlei, flashget, QQ, QQ games. These software are very commonly used in China but always have lots of issues in wine. Huge solutions about these issues have made many confusions but we do not know which solution is right. We then don't need to illeagaly copy $MS .dll if winetricks itself contains these additional .dll files.
Reply to topic 3):I insist that different languages of www.winehq.org should be established in long term, and it is feasible to find someone who are native Chinese to monitor the Chinese winehq website. However, in the short term, we can only link to http://forum.ubuntu.org.cn/viewforum.php?f=121 for the most popular forums about wine. And also you can invite forum-monitoring volunteers via that forum and I am sure there are lots of people willing to take care of it. Best regards! Axel
----- 原文 ----- From: Dan Kegel<dank@kegel.com> Subject:Re: Suggestions about the website of www.winehq.org On Mon, Jul 13, 2009 at 9:47 PM, <axel_xia@sohu.com> wrote:> I am a Chinese user for Fedora and have be trying to use wine for very long> time. Based on my experience in wine evaluation, may I provide my> suggestions on wine development & prospect?Yes, please! But please don't cross-post. Your question probably belongs onwine-devel or wine-users. cc'ing five different mailing lists is nota good idea.> 1) There are many many discussions in the internet about the Chinese font> sets issue in wine (wine very very slow, or can not display Chinese> correctly, & etc). However, most popular Linux distributions almost have no> issues for Chinese character display nowadays, the Chinese version of $MS> windows are perfectly compatible with Chinese character and even all the> softwares for $MS windows use default $MS Chinese fonts without any issues.> So, is that possible for wine/crossover to directly use/share Chinese fonts> (even all fonts of different languages) in linux distributions?As far as I know, the MS chinese fonts are copyrighted, and theirlicense terms do not permit redistribution.(The "microsoft core fonts" were distributed under a very permissivelicense, andare more or less available on all linux systems, but they don't havegood chinese fonts.)If you know of any legally downloadable chinese fonts, please letme know and I'll at least add them to winetricks.If you're saying that Linux already comes with great Chinese fonts,and Wine isn't using them properly, then that sounds like a bugwe need to fix. There are two bugs open right now for CJK fonts:http://bugs.winehq.org/show_bug.cgi?id=13829 (fonts aren't found properly)http://bugs.winehq.org/show_bug.cgi?id=16325 (fonts don't look good)Perhaps you should file one for the slow fonts issue.> 2) Is that possible to have someone from winehq.org to verify $MS software> applicable in wine or not(at lease which .dll should be copy into> ~./wine/.../system32)? I found thousands of $MS softwares are posted on> AppDB in www.winehq.org but only checked by evaluators. So I wonder if> possible for winehq.org people to validate these programs and even better to> tell visitors step by step to run each software in wine. I think it is> better to post the correct steps of $MS software emulation in AppDB because> we need to rely on the offical website. It is harmful that users don't think> AppDB is believable then less and less people will come to www.winehq.org> for help day by day.Sadly, we don't have enough manpower to keep appdb up to dateourselves; we rely on volunteers. Our goal is for there to be no stepsneeded beyond running setup and starting the app, so that'swhat Wine developers tend to spend their time on, and weleave appdb updating to volunteers. That said, it would behelpful for somebody to make a pass over the popular appsin the appdb and update the howtos, including converting ad hoc installationsteps into winetricks steps as appropriate.Any volunteers?> 3) Is that possible to open accounts in Forums of winehq website for common> users? And also is that possible to have different forums in Chinese or in> other languages established worldwide?That's a good idea.We can also link to any other Wine forums that already exist inother languages; do you know of any in Chinese?Thanks again for writing. We've known for a long time thatwe have some issues with Asian languages, but since mostof our developers are not fluent in Asian languages, we haven'tmade much progress on it. We rely on feedback like the messagesyou've been sending lately.- Dan
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axel_xia＠sohu.com -
Dan Kegel