[PATCH] Updates the wine alsa driver to the new alsa api. No functionallity changes.

[James Courtier-Dutton]

Is there any chance of getting my patch into cvs. I could then start 
making further improvements to the winealsa driver.
Currently, the winealsa driver does a lot of stuff it should not, and I 
will changing things to make it more reliable with a wider variety of 
sound cards.

If my patch is not going into CVS, I will not proceed with improvements 
over that.

Cheers
James

P.S. Patch was posted with same subject line to the wine-patches list a 
few days ago.

[Mike Hearn]

On Wed, 05 May 2004 14:21:06 +0000, James Courtier-Dutton wrote:
> Is there any chance of getting my patch into cvs. I could then start 
> making further improvements to the winealsa driver.

It's in CVS now. If you want to work without waiting for AJ to commit, use
the arch repository. It lets you commit to your own local branch and has
a script for generating and sending patch emails in a simple manner.

http://navi.cx/~mike/wine/

thanks -mike

[James Courtier-Dutton]

Mike Hearn wrote:
> On Wed, 05 May 2004 14:21:06 +0000, James Courtier-Dutton wrote:
> > Is there any chance of getting my patch into cvs. I could then start 
> > making further improvements to the winealsa driver.
>
> It's in CVS now. If you want to work without waiting for AJ to commit, use
> the arch repository. It lets you commit to your own local branch and has
> a script for generating and sending patch emails in a simple manner.
>
> http://navi.cx/~mike/wine/
>
> thanks -mike

Thank you.

I have been working on improving wine support for alsa, but have run 
into some problems. Windows sound api is so incredibly bad. :-(
I might just work on getting DirectSound working, and the get winmm to 
use direct sound instead of winmm using the sound card directly.

We need to get to a single API between sound hardware and windows apis.
I think winmm should work over directsound ok. I just need to look into 
what ASIO does now.
We might end up doing winmm over directsound over asio!

Cheers
James

[PATCH] Updates the wine alsa driver to the new alsa api. No functionallity changes.

[Mike Hearn]

On Fri, 2004-05-07 at 19:56 +0000, James Courtier-Dutton wrote:
> I have been working on improving wine support for alsa, but have run 
> into some problems. Windows sound api is so incredibly bad. :-(

Well, you don't work on Wine for the joy of working with the best
tools ...
> I might just work on getting DirectSound working, and the get winmm to 
> use direct sound instead of winmm using the sound card directly.

I'm pretty sure that's the wrong way around. DirectSound is implemented
on top of WinMM for a reason: I'm pretty sure that's how it's done in
Windows and anyway, we don't want to duplicate drivers.
> We need to get to a single API between sound hardware and windows apis.

Yes, that is WinMM
> I think winmm should work over directsound ok. I just need to look into 
> what ASIO does now.

I think ASIO loads kernel drivers and bypasses the whole thing.

thanks -mike

[Robert Reif]

> > I might just work on getting DirectSound working, and the get winmm to 
> > use direct sound instead of winmm using the sound card directly.

You can use Microsoft's dsound.dll in native mode and it will use
wine's winmm drivers.
> I'm pretty sure that's the wrong way around. DirectSound is implemented
> on top of WinMM for a reason: I'm pretty sure that's how it's done in
> Windows and anyway, we don't want to duplicate drivers.
> > We need to get to a single API between sound hardware and windows apis.
>
> Yes, that is WinMM

[Paul Davis]

> > I think winmm should work over directsound ok. I just need to look into 
> > what ASIO does now.
>
> I think ASIO loads kernel drivers and bypasses the whole thing.

ASIO is a vastly superior API for audio programming. Its too bad that
Windows doesn't support it as the standard. It would be really good if
Wine provided ASIO support (well) - several better quality audio apps
on windows use it and it only.

--p

[Jakob Eriksson]

Mike Hearn wrote:
> On Fri, 2004-05-07 at 19:56 +0000, James Courtier-Dutton wrote:
> > I have been working on improving wine support for alsa, but have run 
> > into some problems. Windows sound api is so incredibly bad. :-(
>
> Well, you don't work on Wine for the joy of working with the best
> tools ...
> > I might just work on getting DirectSound working, and the get winmm to 
> > use direct sound instead of winmm using the sound card directly.
>
> I'm pretty sure that's the wrong way around. DirectSound is implemented
> on top of WinMM for a reason: I'm pretty sure that's how it's done in
> Windows and anyway, we don't want to duplicate drivers.

That's counterintuitive to me.  From what I can gather, DirectSound and 
WinMM is pretty
intertwined:

http://kxproject.lugosoft.com/tech.php?language=en

So given a choice I'd rather implement a sucky API (WinMM) on top of a 
not-so-sucky API.
(DirectSound).

Compare how we do it with Direct3D... we don't implement the same 
structure internally
as Microsoft do. If we did, we could use Microsofts Direct3d.dll (or 
whatever it's name is)
and implement our "drivers" against that. Instead we just bypass it 
all... AFAIK.

Also consider that DirectSound is supposed to be somewhat low latency. 
Then it
maybe isn't the best thing to insert another API in between Linux and 
DirectSound.
(But this might not matter in practice.)
> > We need to get to a single API between sound hardware and windows apis.
>
> Yes, that is WinMM
> > I think winmm should work over directsound ok. I just need to look into 
> > what ASIO does now.
>
> I think ASIO loads kernel drivers and bypasses the whole thing.

Yes... Wine should be possible to emulate it nevertheless?

regards,
Jakob

[Roderick Colenbrander]

If you plan to rewrite parts of winmm/dsound it might be better to do it
like Win2k/WinXP do it using "kmixer". This seems to be a redesign of the
whole windows sound stuff.

regards,
Roderick
> Mike Hearn wrote:
> > On Fri, 2004-05-07 at 19:56 +0000, James Courtier-Dutton wrote:
> > > I have been working on improving wine support for alsa, but have run 
> > > into some problems. Windows sound api is so incredibly bad. :-(
> >
> > Well, you don't work on Wine for the joy of working with the best
> > tools ...
> > > I might just work on getting DirectSound working, and the get winmm to 
> > > use direct sound instead of winmm using the sound card directly.
> >
> > I'm pretty sure that's the wrong way around. DirectSound is implemented
> > on top of WinMM for a reason: I'm pretty sure that's how it's done in
> > Windows and anyway, we don't want to duplicate drivers.
>
> That's counterintuitive to me.  From what I can gather, DirectSound and 
> WinMM is pretty
> intertwined:
>
> http://kxproject.lugosoft.com/tech.php?language=en
>
> So given a choice I'd rather implement a sucky API (WinMM) on top of a 
> not-so-sucky API.
> (DirectSound).
>
> Compare how we do it with Direct3D... we don't implement the same 
> structure internally
> as Microsoft do. If we did, we could use Microsofts Direct3d.dll (or 
> whatever it's name is)
> and implement our "drivers" against that. Instead we just bypass it 
> all... AFAIK.
>
> Also consider that DirectSound is supposed to be somewhat low latency. 
> Then it
> maybe isn't the best thing to insert another API in between Linux and 
> DirectSound.
> (But this might not matter in practice.)
> > > We need to get to a single API between sound hardware and windows apis.
> >
> > Yes, that is WinMM
> > > I think winmm should work over directsound ok. I just need to look into 
> > > what ASIO does now.
> >
> > I think ASIO loads kernel drivers and bypasses the whole thing.
>
> Yes... Wine should be possible to emulate it nevertheless?
>
> regards,
> Jakob

[James Courtier-Dutton]

Roderick Colenbrander wrote:
> If you plan to rewrite parts of winmm/dsound it might be better to do it
> like Win2k/WinXP do it using "kmixer". This seems to be a redesign of the
> whole windows sound stuff.
>
> regards,
> Roderick

Where are docs on "kmixer".
I don't use WinXP etc.

Cheers
James

[Roderick Colenbrander]

There's some kmixer info (including examples) on msdn but the way it is 
organized is a pain. After clicking some links you in the end come to where 
you started.

For example a start point might be this: 
http://msdn.microsoft.com/library/default.asp?url=/library/en-us/stream/hh/s...
http://msdn.microsoft.com/library/default.asp?url=/library/en-us/stream/hh/s...

For better info and headers (ksmixer.h and others) you might need a Windows 
DDK.

Roderick

On Saturday 08 May 2004 18:50, James Courtier-Dutton wrote:
> Roderick Colenbrander wrote:
> > If you plan to rewrite parts of winmm/dsound it might be better to do it
> > like Win2k/WinXP do it using "kmixer". This seems to be a redesign of the
> > whole windows sound stuff.
> >
> > regards,
> > Roderick
>
> Where are docs on "kmixer".
> I don't use WinXP etc.
>
> Cheers
> James