I asked project davied if they know what use of LGPL code involves, and if the're using wine code, I got the following answer. The impression I have is that they are using major parts of wine. They claim they will fully comply with the LGPL. Here is the full email they sent me.
Good Evening Mr. Smith
Thanks for your email; We appreciate your taking the time to delve into Project David. We feel certain that the closer that you look at the project the more comfortable you will be with it.
Our overall purpose of the project is to encourage consumers to use Linux. Our David Linux/Win Bridge software is simply a product to facilitate the transition to Linux. Our Linux/Win Bridge software is one of multiple components, which comprise our OS platform. In the future we will release another component, which is a set of tools that will encourage developers to write native Linux applications.
The David software is a joint development effort between De La Salle University and SpecOpS Labs. Our Chief Technical Officer is Mr. Peter Valdez. As you may know Mr. Valdez is the founder of Tivoli Systems, which is now a multi billion-dollar flagship product of IBM.
The code for our Windows/Linux Bridge is a hybrid of code, including our own proprietary code, and code from several open source projects. For now we are keeping the exact nature of our code under wraps until our first release of David. We are not using pirated or stolen code from Microsoft or any other source. As stated we are not disclosing the nature of our code or our exact methodology for running Windows Apps on Linux, this is for competitive and other reasons. However, a good deal of our success is attributed to our innovative methodology in assembling together open source code, proprietary code that we have written/purchased, and freeware. In the future, once we disclose how we have done this, then Im sure a number of developers will be kicking themselves in the rear end for not having thought of this themselves.
We do encourage the open source movement and we will comply with the GNU LESSER GENERAL PUBLIC LICENSE.
Our website is currently under construction, the data (*especially the technical data) on the website for the most part is not current and in some cases is up to 20+ months old. We are now in the process of doing a major overhaul of the site, which we expect to be completed in a few weeks. *The technical data on our web site concerning David, is outdated and in some cases a competitive smoke screen. We appreciate your comments on the WINE Project and we have no intention of misrepresenting the WINE. Therefore, we are now consulting our English-technical writers and the Filipino - designers/developers of David to ensure that there are no mistakes in the translation. Until we can update the website we have disabled the links to both our technical and competitive data. Hopefully, the development community wont get wrapped around the axle about David, and will withhold judgment until David is released.
So far as our product goes we just completed our prototype, which has been in the making for quite some time. Our first release will be issued before the end of 2004; we expect to start Beta Testing in about 4-5 months. On 22 April we held a press conference at De La Salle University. During the press conference we demonstrated our prototype to more than 30 members of the local and international media. During the demo we ran Macromedia Flash, and MS Office on our Windows/Linux Bridge without a hitch. What you read in the media was primarily the result of the press conference/demo. David is not a hoax or vaporware, but we're not going to make any further claims about David at this point, We prefer to let our software do our talking for us.
FYI: We are now a publicly traded company, our ticker symbol is SPLMF, you can view it on any major financial website such as Merrill Lynch: http://askmerrill.ml.com/markets_chart/1,2260,,00.html?q=SPLMF
Thanks
Customer Service SpecOpS Labs Summit One Office Tower Unit 23-H, 530 Shaw Blvd Mandaluyong City, Metro Manila, Philippines
Office 63 2 532-7854 Fax 63 2 532-5875
I sent an inquiry and got the exact same response (twice), i believe it's a scripted response system. (In my case, it was "Good Evening, Mr. Hentenaar").
The claims they make about wine are just hillarious. :P I don't think they've ever even looked at the wine code, or else they'd know that thier claims are unfounded. :P
Tim
On Mon, 26 Apr 2004 18:59:34 +0200 "Ivan Leo Murray-Smith" puoti@inwind.it wrote:
I asked project davied if they know what use of LGPL code involves, and if the're using wine code, I got the following answer. The impression I have is that they are using major parts of wine. They claim they will fully comply with the LGPL. Here is the full email they sent me.
Good Evening Mr. Smith
Thanks for your email; We appreciate your taking the time to delve into Project David. We feel certain that the closer that you look at the project the more comfortable you will be with it.
Our overall purpose of the project is to encourage consumers to use Linux. Our David Linux/Win Bridge software is simply a product to facilitate the transition to Linux. Our Linux/Win Bridge software is one of multiple components, which comprise our OS platform. In the future we will release another component, which is a set of tools that will encourage developers to write native Linux applications.
The David software is a joint development effort between De La Salle University and SpecOpS Labs. Our Chief Technical Officer is Mr. Peter Valdez. As you may know Mr. Valdez is the founder of Tivoli Systems, which is now a multi billion-dollar flagship product of IBM.
The code for our Windows/Linux Bridge is a hybrid of code, including our own proprietary code, and code from several open source projects. For now we are keeping the exact nature of our code under wraps until our first release of David. We are not using pirated or stolen code from Microsoft or any other source. As stated we are not disclosing the nature of our code or our exact methodology for running Windows Apps on Linux, this is for competitive and other reasons. However, a good deal of our success is attributed to our innovative methodology in assembling together open source code, proprietary code that we have written/purchased, and freeware. In the future, once we disclose how we have done this, then Im sure a number of developers will be kicking themselves in the rear end for not having thought of this themselves.
We do encourage the open source movement and we will comply with the GNU LESSER GENERAL PUBLIC LICENSE.
Our website is currently under construction, the data (*especially the technical data) on the website for the most part is not current and in some cases is up to 20+ months old. We are now in the process of doing a major overhaul of the site, which we expect to be completed in a few weeks. *The technical data on our web site concerning David, is outdated and in some cases a competitive smoke screen. We appreciate your comments on the WINE Project and we have no intention of misrepresenting the WINE. Therefore, we are now consulting our English-technical writers and the Filipino - designers/developers of David to ensure that there are no mistakes in the translation. Until we can update the website we have disabled the links to both our technical and competitive data. Hopefully, the development community wont get wrapped around the axle about David, and will withhold judgment until David is released.
So far as our product goes we just completed our prototype, which has been in the making for quite some time. Our first release will be issued before the end of 2004; we expect to start Beta Testing in about 4-5 months. On 22 April we held a press conference at De La Salle University. During the press conference we demonstrated our prototype to more than 30 members of the local and international media. During the demo we ran Macromedia Flash, and MS Office on our Windows/Linux Bridge without a hitch. What you read in the media was primarily the result of the press conference/demo. David is not a hoax or vaporware, but we're not going to make any further claims about David at this point, We prefer to let our software do our talking for us.
FYI: We are now a publicly traded company, our ticker symbol is SPLMF, you can view it on any major financial website such as Merrill Lynch: http://askmerrill.ml.com/markets_chart/1,2260,,00.html?q=SPLMF
Thanks
Customer Service SpecOpS Labs Summit One Office Tower Unit 23-H, 530 Shaw Blvd Mandaluyong City, Metro Manila, Philippines
Office 63 2 532-7854 Fax 63 2 532-5875
On Mon, Apr 26, 2004 at 01:58:56PM -0400, Tim Hentenaar wrote:
I sent an inquiry and got the exact same response (twice), i believe it's a scripted response system. (In my case, it was "Good Evening, Mr. Hentenaar").
The claims they make about wine are just hillarious. :P I don't think they've ever even looked at the wine code, or else they'd know that thier claims are unfounded. :P
I don't think they have writting anything yet, just vaporware the whole thing.
Ciao, Marcus
There's a story today on the results of the "unveiling" last week:
On Mon, 26 Apr 2004 15:24:07 -0500 "R.U. Deranged" yes_this_is_a_real_address@earthlink.net wrote:
There's a story today on the results of the "unveiling" last week:
Interesting... A few things in that article don't seem right.. If the dude said that "David" was running the power point presentation, then why did he have to have his aide install it a second time (and install M$ Office a second time)?
"Chua subsequently opened each Microsoft Office application, and showed that the "look-and-feel" of the applications remained intact, only this time it was running on a Linux box.
By the time he ended the demo, the audience was applauding."
Sounds like an easily moved audience. He could have simply been running Crossover Office, or Wine itself. I haven't tried installing Office under Wine, because I don't have a copy, but from what I've heard it's usable under Crossover Office.
In thier autogenerated response email, they say that they intend to comply with the LGPL, so my biggest question is, when are they going to release thier supposedly LGPL'd code? :P I'd bet there is a lot of Wine code in there, otherwise why would they write:
"[...] and we will comply with the GNU LESSER GENERAL PUBLIC LICENSE."
I find it hillarious that they're making unfounded comments about Wine, yet more than likely at least 50%+ of thier code is Wine code, if there is any code at all.
Tim
Hi everyone,
May I make a small suggestion? I think we should really reserve judgement until we see something. While such projects are, indeed, often smoke and broken mirrors, occasionally you get a good technical team that is hidden behind a clueless PR front. Let's wait and see - so long as they havn't released, they can claim whatever they like.
Tim Hentenaar wrote:
In thier autogenerated response email, they say that they intend to comply with the LGPL, so my biggest question is, when are they going to release thier supposedly LGPL'd code? :P I'd bet there is a lot of Wine code in there, otherwise why would they write:
The LGPL only requires them to provide the sources of what they distribute, and only to those they distribute to. In other words, as they have not handed out any CDs with the code just yet, they are not required to give anyone anything.
I repeat - let's just wait and see.
On Monday 26 April 2004 11:14 pm, Shachar Shemesh wrote:
May I make a small suggestion? I think we should really reserve judgement until we see something. While such projects are, indeed, often smoke and broken mirrors, occasionally you get a good technical team that is hidden behind a clueless PR front. Let's wait and see - so long as they havn't released, they can claim whatever they like.
General Turgidson: Uh, we're, still trying to figure out the meaning of that last phrase, sir.
President Merkin Muffley: There's nothing to figure out, General Turgidson. This man is obviously a psychotic.
General Turgidson: We-he-ell, uh, I'd like to hold off judgement on a thing like that, sir, until all the facts are in.
;-)
I think I know what this David thing is all about!
Please Read: http://www.datiku.com/articles/david.php
On Tue, 27 Apr 2004 02:02:32 -0400 Abby Ricart aricart@rochester.rr.com wrote:
I think I know what this David thing is all about!
Please Read: http://www.datiku.com/articles/david.php
Interesting theory. If that were true, then "David" could potentially be the most elaborate ripoff i've ever seen.
"The next generation will, in effect, incorporate the operating system into the web browser, virtually eliminating the need for an operating system eventually, except to boot the computer and launch the browser."
That would be a very scary thing. How in god's name could you incorporate an OS into a web browser, shouldn't it be the other way around? :P (well, they could have "david" running in Java, but that dosen't sound to feasable to me.)
Assuming that they did have "david" in the kernel, and also assuming that they hold true to thier comments that david takes away the risk for "blue screens", as they had put it, then more than likely people'd be seeing a lot of white text on a red screen saying something along the lines of "David has caused a Page Fault (GPF) in module david.ko (0xdeadbeef). Please restart your computer." (i.e. Red Screen of Death [RSOD]) :P
Tim
I removed this article speculating on the true nature of David based on further technical analysis of my hypothesis. Held as much water as SpecOpS claims does. Sorry to waste your time :)
On Mon, 26 Apr 2004 18:51:22 -0400, Tim Hentenaar wrote: Sounds like an easily moved audience. He could have simply been running Crossover Office, or Wine itself. I haven't tried installing Office under Wine, because I don't have a copy, but from what I've heard it's usable under Crossover Office.
Right. So far every app they've demoed, surprise surprise, are ones that work very well in CrossOver/Wine. In fact Office 2000 is one of the best working apps on CrossOver around. Once they demo an app that flat out fails with a million stubs on Wine I'll be impressed.
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Abby Ricart -
Ivan Leo Murray-Smith -
Marcus Meissner -
Mike Hearn -
R.U. Deranged -
Shachar Shemesh -
Tim Hentenaar