Here is the summary of the votes I received in answer to the request to switch to a copyleft-style license:
Agree Disagree Indifferent
All votes: 76 (70%) 15 (14%) 17 (16%)
Contributors: 39 (66%) 7 (12%) 13 (22%)
Contrib. weighted: 59 (64%) 13 (14%) 20 (22%)
The first line counts all the votes I received. The second line counts the votes of all people/companies who contributed some code to the project. The last line counts all contributors again but with each being given 1, 2, or 3 votes depending on the importance of his contributions (this evaluation is obviously a bit subjective, but I think the overall trend is clear).
Intresting to note is that contributors that disagree are on average ranked higher (almost 2) but the contributors that agree are ranked lower (about 1.5).
This means that people that has more effort to protect are less willing to do so. Very intresting.
The only reasonably conclusion for this that I can think of is that people with more to protect have thought more on the drawbacks on copyleft licenses (especially the LGPL) than people with less to protect.
The obvious result of this vote is that my previous conclusion was wrong: there is clearly widespread support in the community for a copyleft-style license.
For some copyleft-style license perhaps. I'm not entirely against copyleft-style licenses either even if I voted disagree.
However don't be so sure that all that voted for it really wants a license like the LGPL that prevent (at least according to your interpretation) using for example proprietary libraries to implement some functionalility. Or for that matter prevents Transgaming to add copy protection that they can't release openly because of a NDA.
Calling proprietary libraries is something that I have been trying to explain is not just something "evil" companies out to earn a profit do, but also quite reasonably people just trying to help themselves or some friends to run applications under Wine. Is it really morally or ethically right to prevent that?
I also asked how that is compatible with freedom 3 of the Free Software defintion: "The freedom to improve the program, and release your improvements to the public, so that the whole community benefits."
With 2 out of 3 contributors in favor of the switch, and less than 15% opposed to it, it's clear that we are going to proceed with the change.
We now have to decide the implementation details, like the exact license used, whether to require copyright assignments, etc.
I think the first thing me need to do is to properly discuss what we want to accieve with the license and even more importantly what we think is acceptable to sacrifice.
Then we must vote on what is important to prevent and what is important to avoid preventing.
Especially we must vote on for example whether preventing Transgamings business model is reasonable and similar specific cases.
After we have done that we can see if any existing license fits something that the majority agrees on or whether it is appropriete design a license of our own that does.
I'm not at all sure that the LGPL is a good alternative at least not without properly clarify what paragraph 2d means as well as making certain that the majority of contributors really wants a license that means whatever paragraph 2d means.
Another thing. It is not nessary to have the whole of wine under the same license. For example the header files (wine/include/*.h) might be appropriate to have under the current license or even under public domain to facillitate sharing with other projects.
My suggestion is that we create a separate mailing list to discuss that, to avoid drowning wine-devel under yet another license flame war.
Agreed. I have subscribed to it and are ready to continue the debate there.
On Tue, Feb 19, 2002 at 02:37:40PM +0100, Patrik Stridvall wrote:
Here is the summary of the votes I received in answer to the request to switch to a copyleft-style license:
Agree Disagree Indifferent
All votes: 76 (70%) 15 (14%) 17 (16%)
Contributors: 39 (66%) 7 (12%) 13 (22%)
Contrib. weighted: 59 (64%) 13 (14%) 20 (22%)
The first line counts all the votes I received. The second line counts the votes of all people/companies who contributed some code to the project. The last line counts all contributors again but with each being given 1, 2, or 3 votes depending on the importance of his contributions (this evaluation is obviously a bit subjective, but I think the overall trend is clear).
Intresting to note is that contributors that disagree are on average ranked higher (almost 2) but the contributors that agree are ranked lower (about 1.5).
This means that people that has more effort to protect are less willing to do so. Very intresting.
The only reasonably conclusion for this that I can think of is that people with more to protect have thought more on the drawbacks on copyleft licenses (especially the LGPL) than people with less to protect.
This is not the only reasonable conclusion that can be drawn from the numbers, just the one that happens to agree with your position. I can think of several other reasonable conclusions which are much less complementary to BSD supporters, but I'm not looking for a flame war, so I'll not share them. ;)
For some copyleft-style license perhaps. I'm not entirely against copyleft-style licenses either even if I voted disagree.
However don't be so sure that all that voted for it really wants a license like the LGPL that prevent (at least according to your interpretation) using for example proprietary libraries to implement some functionalility.
This is a spurious argument. You tell us that you voted that you disagree, then ask us to not assume that those who voted in favor agree with the LGPL -- but provide no evidence to the contrary?
In any case, the precise license chosen is an issue yet to be hashed out; and it seems the wine-license mailing list is the place to do that.
Or for that matter prevents Transgaming to add copy protection that they can't release openly because of a NDA.
I'm afraid Transgaming gets no sympathy from me if a future Wine license prevents them from working on copy protection functionality. The DMCA is fundamentally broken; technological mechanisms to prevent copying are fundamentally broken because there can be no protection for fair use rights; and any company that uses such copy protection mechanisms should be thoroughly boycotted. While I don't condemn TransGaming for trying to support copy-protection mechanisms in Wine -- corporations are by definition amoral -- I also won't shed any tears if this particular business model falls by the wayside.
Various headers set to attempt to redirect this thread over to the list where it belongs now.
Steve Langasek postmodern programmer
On 2-19-02 Patrik Stridvall Wrote Another thing. It is not nessary to have the whole of wine under the same license. For example the header files (wine/include/*.h) might be appropriate to have under the current license or even under public domain to facillitate sharing with other projects.
I think this needs more disscussion. Take a look at the Wine/Mingw/ReactOS header file mess.
Steven
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