I would prefer 10.15 in particular so we could drop support for native (i.e. macho) 32-bit binaries. That would allow us to use modern Obj-C runtime features (e.g. auto-synthesis) and eventually consider ARC. It's also worth noting that winehq's gitlab CI runs 10.15.
On 4/11/24 11:06 AM, dgreer@codeweavers.com wrote:
I can safely say that upstream wine hasn't work on 10.8 since 7.22 ish, wine-8.21 the lowest is probably 10.10 though I've aired on the side of caution and locked 7.22 to require 10.11.
The absolute lowest would be 10.13 though I'd already dropped support below 10.15 in the winehq packages (installed via brew cask system), myself and Marzent have long been in favor of upping the minimum requirement for sometime.
---------- Forwarded message --------- From: *Tim Clem* <tclem@codeweavers.com <mailto:tclem@codeweavers.com>> Date: Thu, Apr 11, 2024 at 1:51 PM Subject: Bumping the minimum supported macOS version To: <wine-devel@winehq.org <mailto:wine-devel@winehq.org>> Hello everyone-- I'm proposing raising the official minimum supported macOS version to Catalina, 10.15. According to the wiki (https://wiki.winehq.org/MacOS <https://wiki.winehq.org/MacOS>), we theoretically support 10.8. Does anyone object? Thanks! --Tim
On Apr 11, 2024, at 11:14 AM, Tim Clem tclem@codeweavers.com wrote:
I would prefer 10.15 in particular so we could drop support for native (i.e. macho) 32-bit binaries. That would allow us to use modern Obj-C runtime features (e.g. auto-synthesis) and eventually consider ARC. It's also worth noting that winehq's gitlab CI runs 10.15.
I’m totally on board with raising the minimum version to 10.13. I’m slightly more hesitant to go to 10.15, just since there are a lot of Macs and software that can only run (on) 10.13 or 10.14. But Firefox, Chrome, and Steam have all raised their minimum versions to 10.15 in the last year (and they were among the last to do so). We can’t support them forever, and anyone who needs to run 10.13 or 10.14 can keep running Wine 9.0. Ultimately I think I’m good with 10.15, although I’m curious whether Dean has any more info.
Dean, do you know if there are many users of your ports on 10.13/10.14? Your MacPorts packages still support those, right?
(Also for those who aren’t aware, CrossOver requires 10.15 starting with this year’s version 24).
Brendan
Dean, do you know if there are many users of your ports on 10.13/10.14?
The main Ports no longer support macOS Sonoma (wine-stable, wine-devel & wine-staging), I do provide alternative Portfiles that work for all legacy versions of macOS from 10.6.8 to 10.14.
It’s also a nightmare buiding on 10.14 thanks to some macports maintainers not believing that Xcode10 Command Line Tools provided a headers package that enabled the ability to build for i386 & x86_64.
Your MacPorts packages still support those, right?
If your referring to the Winehq packages installable via brew cask system?, no those only support macOS Catalina or later, there’s really been no complaints.
Something else to keep in mind is these legacy versions of macOS also have expired certs.
On Mon, Apr 15, 2024 at 7:15 PM Brendan Shanks bshanks@codeweavers.com wrote:
On Apr 11, 2024, at 11:14 AM, Tim Clem tclem@codeweavers.com wrote:
I would prefer 10.15 in particular so we could drop support for native
(i.e. macho) 32-bit binaries. That would allow us to use modern Obj-C runtime features (e.g. auto-synthesis) and eventually consider ARC. It's also worth noting that winehq's gitlab CI runs 10.15.
I’m totally on board with raising the minimum version to 10.13. I’m slightly more hesitant to go to 10.15, just since there are a lot of Macs and software that can only run (on) 10.13 or 10.14. But Firefox, Chrome, and Steam have all raised their minimum versions to 10.15 in the last year (and they were among the last to do so). We can’t support them forever, and anyone who needs to run 10.13 or 10.14 can keep running Wine 9.0. Ultimately I think I’m good with 10.15, although I’m curious whether Dean has any more info.
Dean, do you know if there are many users of your ports on 10.13/10.14? Your MacPorts packages still support those, right?
(Also for those who aren’t aware, CrossOver requires 10.15 starting with this year’s version 24).
Brendan
Sorry no longer supports below macOS Catalina.
On Mon, Apr 15, 2024 at 10:18 PM Dean Greer gcenx83@gmail.com wrote:
Dean, do you know if there are many users of your ports on 10.13/10.14?
The main Ports no longer support macOS Sonoma (wine-stable, wine-devel & wine-staging), I do provide alternative Portfiles that work for all legacy versions of macOS from 10.6.8 to 10.14.
It’s also a nightmare buiding on 10.14 thanks to some macports maintainers not believing that Xcode10 Command Line Tools provided a headers package that enabled the ability to build for i386 & x86_64.
Your MacPorts packages still support those, right?
If your referring to the Winehq packages installable via brew cask system?, no those only support macOS Catalina or later, there’s really been no complaints.
Something else to keep in mind is these legacy versions of macOS also have expired certs.
On Mon, Apr 15, 2024 at 7:15 PM Brendan Shanks bshanks@codeweavers.com wrote:
On Apr 11, 2024, at 11:14 AM, Tim Clem tclem@codeweavers.com wrote:
I would prefer 10.15 in particular so we could drop support for native
(i.e. macho) 32-bit binaries. That would allow us to use modern Obj-C runtime features (e.g. auto-synthesis) and eventually consider ARC. It's also worth noting that winehq's gitlab CI runs 10.15.
I’m totally on board with raising the minimum version to 10.13. I’m slightly more hesitant to go to 10.15, just since there are a lot of Macs and software that can only run (on) 10.13 or 10.14. But Firefox, Chrome, and Steam have all raised their minimum versions to 10.15 in the last year (and they were among the last to do so). We can’t support them forever, and anyone who needs to run 10.13 or 10.14 can keep running Wine 9.0. Ultimately I think I’m good with 10.15, although I’m curious whether Dean has any more info.
Dean, do you know if there are many users of your ports on 10.13/10.14? Your MacPorts packages still support those, right?
(Also for those who aren’t aware, CrossOver requires 10.15 starting with this year’s version 24).
Brendan
Another thing to keep in mind is we’ll need access to i386_ldt_set so we’ll really require macOS Catalina 10.15.4
It’s not like we’re even able to reference macports for wine installs on legacy systems as there “wine” offering are ancient and broken for years now.
The Winehq packages currently served via brews cask system require macOS Catalina, wine-stable alone is currently at 90,000 downloads. Wine-9.3 is at almost 25,000 and wine-9.7 that was added to brew yesterday is currently under 3,00 downloads (mainly staging)
On Mon, Apr 15, 2024 at 10:34 PM Dean Greer gcenx83@gmail.com wrote:
Sorry no longer supports below macOS Catalina.
On Mon, Apr 15, 2024 at 10:18 PM Dean Greer gcenx83@gmail.com wrote:
Dean, do you know if there are many users of your ports on 10.13/10.14?
The main Ports no longer support macOS Sonoma (wine-stable, wine-devel & wine-staging), I do provide alternative Portfiles that work for all legacy versions of macOS from 10.6.8 to 10.14.
It’s also a nightmare buiding on 10.14 thanks to some macports maintainers not believing that Xcode10 Command Line Tools provided a headers package that enabled the ability to build for i386 & x86_64.
Your MacPorts packages still support those, right?
If your referring to the Winehq packages installable via brew cask system?, no those only support macOS Catalina or later, there’s really been no complaints.
Something else to keep in mind is these legacy versions of macOS also have expired certs.
On Mon, Apr 15, 2024 at 7:15 PM Brendan Shanks bshanks@codeweavers.com wrote:
On Apr 11, 2024, at 11:14 AM, Tim Clem tclem@codeweavers.com wrote:
I would prefer 10.15 in particular so we could drop support for native
(i.e. macho) 32-bit binaries. That would allow us to use modern Obj-C runtime features (e.g. auto-synthesis) and eventually consider ARC. It's also worth noting that winehq's gitlab CI runs 10.15.
I’m totally on board with raising the minimum version to 10.13. I’m slightly more hesitant to go to 10.15, just since there are a lot of Macs and software that can only run (on) 10.13 or 10.14. But Firefox, Chrome, and Steam have all raised their minimum versions to 10.15 in the last year (and they were among the last to do so). We can’t support them forever, and anyone who needs to run 10.13 or 10.14 can keep running Wine 9.0. Ultimately I think I’m good with 10.15, although I’m curious whether Dean has any more info.
Dean, do you know if there are many users of your ports on 10.13/10.14? Your MacPorts packages still support those, right?
(Also for those who aren’t aware, CrossOver requires 10.15 starting with this year’s version 24).
Brendan
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Brendan Shanks -
Dean Greer -
Tim Clem