After opening the metabug for windows original progs I decided to do some more work on bugzilla but this time ordering insted of adding....
So I opened a metabug for games and pupolated it accordingly (also annonced it on wine-users@winehq.org). So no you can help fix games (or ignore them more easly).
I am also thinking about opening a few more sticky metabugs like: regresion bugs site bugs fix-me/stub/unimplemented bugs application bugs and misc bugs
This will get kind of a nice order to the bugs and allow you to track that ones that are of intrest to you.....
What do you think about that?
Please someone replay this time... :), Hatky.
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On Thu, 1 May 2003, hatky wrote:
I am also thinking about opening a few more sticky metabugs like: regresion bugs
This doesn't sound right.
site bugs
We have "WineHQ.com" listed under Programs, this is a better way of doing it IMO.
fix-me/stub/unimplemented bugs
Please don't, it will clutter Bugzilla way to much.
application bugs
Like what?
and misc bugs
No need for such a meta bug. I know you like trees, but let's not go crazy here :)
Okkkkkkkkkkkkkkkk..............
So you do not like metabugs at all?
I guess you only want them being used as sub bugs and not categories but I got my ideas from the wine-0.9 and wine-1.0 metabugs....
Can't we compermise somewhere?
Hatky. --- "Dimitrie O. Paun" dimi@intelliware.ca wrote:
On Thu, 1 May 2003, hatky wrote:
I am also thinking about opening a few more sticky metabugs like: regresion bugs
This doesn't sound right.
site bugs
We have "WineHQ.com" listed under Programs, this is a better way of doing it IMO.
fix-me/stub/unimplemented bugs
Please don't, it will clutter Bugzilla way to much.
application bugs
Like what?
and misc bugs
No need for such a meta bug. I know you like trees, but let's not go crazy here :)
-- Dimi.
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On Thu, 1 May 2003, hatky wrote:
Okkkkkkkkkkkkkkkk..............
So you do not like metabugs at all?
It's not that I don't like metabugs, I just don't think they are a good idea in the particular instances you mentioned.
I guess you only want them being used as sub bugs and not categories but I got my ideas from the wine-0.9 and wine-1.0 metabugs....
Those are better suited for being a metabug.
Can't we compermise somewhere?
No.
:)
Just kiddin'.
OK, you have another proposal?
Ok, with you permission I like to get this subject changed a bit to clearing bugzilla.
I noticed there are plenty of bugs and little activity on any of then many of them look outdated.
So I would like Step One to be getting all the bugs that there last comment was before 6 months or more commented as please test it again or we will close it in the next 30. I really hope you agree with me about that becouse with so many open bug I think most developer DO NOT want to trak the bugzilla any more...
Secound Step I would want to do is getting the bugs into some categories so it will be easy for developer to track the bugs that intrest them thats where I was going with my meta bugs becouse I for instence what to know about every bug that is realated to games and see if I can confirm it and/or help solving it, as you do not seem to like my idea of using meta bugs for this how would you like to see this beeing done?
btw just to understend this is a meta bug of getting game x to work and under it all the uniplemented or/and broken stuff ok?
The last step (and an importent one) would be to try keep the traking a live by insreting both developers and users to look at them and keep updating them.
Do you agree with anything I said so far or am I just talking newbee crap?
Hatky.
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On Fri, 2003-05-02 at 08:47, hatky wrote:
Ok, with you permission I like to get this subject changed a bit to clearing bugzilla.
I noticed there are plenty of bugs and little activity on any of then many of them look outdated.
Yeah, this is a problem for all bugzillas. About a month or two ago a few of us went through and cleaned some out. Needs doing more often really though.
So I would like Step One to be getting all the bugs that there last comment was before 6 months or more commented as please test it again or we will close it in the next 30.
This sounds like a good idea. We've done it before, but it takes time to track them all.
I really hope you agree with me about that becouse with so many open bug I think most developer DO NOT want to trak the bugzilla any more...
Well, I know I mostly go by the wine-bugs mailing list, but it does make bugs easy to forget about. Remember though that often people just don't know the answer.....
Secound Step I would want to do is getting the bugs into some categories so it will be easy for developer to track the bugs that intrest them
This idea I'm not so sure about. If somebody is interested in working on games, then they can fire up games they actually own and start fixing bugs. Unfortunately Wine is not yet at the stage where people find it hard to locate bugs :(
btw just to understend this is a meta bug of getting game x to work and under it all the uniplemented or/and broken stuff ok?
I think these things are better done when somebody with drive says "I'm going to make game X work" and then goes ahead and solves them all - the chances of finding 2 or 3 people all with that game and all with that drive/level of skill is fairly rare, they all work on different games.
The last step (and an importent one) would be to try keep the traking a live by insreting both developers and users to look at them and keep updating them.
If nobody knows what causes a bug, or the bug is "implement feature X" then no amount of tracking will get the work done quicker. It basically boils down to a terminal lack of manpower.
Do you agree with anything I said so far or am I just talking newbee crap?
It's good you're thinking about these things, but experience with bugzillas tells me that especially for a project like Wine, while it can be very useful to track odd bugs/regressions etc, for more general things it's not so useful.
thanks -mike
--- Mike Hearn m.hearn@signal.qinetiq.com wrote:
On Fri, 2003-05-02 at 08:47, hatky wrote:
Ok, with you permission I like to get this subject changed a bit to clearing bugzilla.
I noticed there are plenty of bugs and little
activity
on any of then many of them look outdated.
Yeah, this is a problem for all bugzillas. About a month or two ago a few of us went through and cleaned some out. Needs doing more often really though.
So I would like Step One to be getting all the
bugs
that there last comment was before 6 months or
more
commented as please test it again or we will close
it
in the next 30.
This sounds like a good idea. We've done it before, but it takes time to track them all.
Can't we do automaticly? I am pretty sure there can be an sql select that can get that then we need to feel a form... I realy think I could have a php file that does that if I hade the table stracture ... Then we can run it dayly as a cron job and no bug will be really left out to die (I am only talking about the traking prosses here)
I really hope you agree with me about that becouse with so many open bug I think most developer DO
NOT
want to trak the bugzilla any more...
Well, I know I mostly go by the wine-bugs mailing list, but it does make bugs easy to forget about. Remember though that often people just don't know the answer.....
I undertend that but if you know of a bug that says it gets into a race condition and you see in wine-cvs that a patch aginst race conditions have been aplied even if you are not sure that that the same race condition asking the user to test it again can be helpfool, better then leaving a bug with the last test some where on 2001 or earlier with no other comments...
Secound Step I would want to do is getting the
bugs
into some categories so it will be easy for
developer
to track the bugs that intrest them
This idea I'm not so sure about. If somebody is interested in working on games, then they can fire up games they actually own and start fixing bugs.
That why I rather have big meta bugs and then the errors in them as sub bugs that way: 1.If you are trying to fix problem X you can locate a few testcases that would help you ensure you solved it right. 2.If you fix problem y we can tell to all users with games that have problem y we are a step closer to running there game (game or app or any other program) 3.You can see with function that is still missing is most needed, I was thinking it would probebly be usefull for people like workers of codewavers but would you rather fix a problem with one program or a problem you know make 15 programs not work? I personaly sould like to sort my prioritys on the problems that block the most programs (I am making sence right?)
Unfortunately Wine is not yet at the stage where people find it hard to locate bugs :(
That would mean we could drop bugzilla all toghter (I am nither aginst nor for) but as long as it's up I think we sould maintain the bugs in it as it was ment to be.
btw just to understend this is a meta bug of
getting
game x to work and under it all the uniplemented or/and broken stuff ok?
I think these things are better done when somebody with drive says "I'm going to make game X work" and then goes ahead and solves them all - the chances of finding 2 or 3 people all with that game and all with that drive/level of skill is fairly rare, they all work on different games.
I was thinking about bugzilla as being for both users and developers so when that time comes where deleoper1 has all the program he owns working (hopfully soon ;-) optimistic ha?) he could help fixing programs he does not own, that a user reportes an with bugzilla getting the developer to fix and the user to test.... (Besides why sould a developer waist his/her time testing every feather of a big program? We can let users do it and gain a little more programming time)
The last step (and an importent one) would be to
try
keep the traking a live by insreting both
developers
and users to look at them and keep updating them.
If nobody knows what causes a bug, or the bug is "implement feature X" then no amount of tracking will get the work done quicker. It basically boils down to a terminal lack of manpower.
I do agree that if no one know why that happened then it is a problem but even so it sould be tested again after a few months for a by mistake fix :)
It is know we lack in man power thats they I say we use bigzilla get let users do testing insted of developers, and the more bugs will be solved the more users will join and the more bugs will be up to date the more users will use bugzilla and the more users wine has the more news it will get and more new developers that will solve more bugs.
Do you agree with anything I said so far or am I
just
talking newbee crap?
It's good you're thinking about these things, but experience with bugzillas tells me that especially for a project like Wine, while it can be very useful to track odd bugs/regressions etc, for more general things it's not so useful.
Do you want to make a defintion of what bugs we sould open and track and what sould not get into bugzilla at all?
thanks -mike
-- Mike Hearn m.hearn@signal.qinetiq.com QinetiQ - Malvern Technology Center
Hatky.
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fix-me/stub/unimplemented bugs application bugs and misc bugs
I have to agree with Dimi, sorry. Do you realise just how many of these damn things there are? Grep the source, there are easily thousands, many of which are harmless, or are just chatter about functionality we've known has been missing for years. There's no need for a bug about the lack of a richedit control in bugzilla, we're all aware of this.
Ok so mybe the fix-me/stub/unimplemented bugs category is a really bad idea but we are having diffrent opinions on the more general idea of using metabugs as categories...
Hatky. --- Mike Hearn m.hearn@signal.qinetiq.com wrote:
fix-me/stub/unimplemented bugs application bugs and misc bugs
I have to agree with Dimi, sorry. Do you realise just how many of these damn things there are? Grep the source, there are easily thousands, many of which are harmless, or are just chatter about functionality we've known has been missing for years. There's no need for a bug about the lack of a richedit control in bugzilla, we're all aware of this.
-- Mike Hearn m.hearn@signal.qinetiq.com QinetiQ - Malvern Technology Center
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-
Dimitrie O. Paun -
hatky -
Mike Hearn