February 2009 - Wine-Devel - list.winehq.org

Re: Fixing AppDB once and for all

by Alexander Nicolaysen Sørnes

Tirsdag 03 februar 2009 20:27:25 skrev Zachary Goldberg: > 2009/2/3 James Mckenzie <jjmckenzie51(a)earthlink.net>: > > This would be too early for people on the West Coast of the United States > > by about three hours. > > > > No time will be satisfactory for all people who work on this project. > > > > What I feel is necessary at this point is to collect who lives in what > > time zone so that we incovience as few people as possible. > > > > Since this would be Saturday in Asia, this time may work for the majority > > of the people on this list. > > > > Also, will there be a transcript of the discussion and where will it be > > placed since this has a major impact on the functionality of the > > Applications Database. > > > > James McKenzie > > I have made a wiki on winehq with an agenda which will be updated with > the results (and maybe transcript?) of the conversation. > > http://wiki.winehq.org/AppDBUpgrades Great initiative! But I don't think I can make it to the meeting. I recently got appdb commit access, so I can see about making the changes. What if we add a small questionnaire which will then pick the approprite Gold/Silver ... rating? Alexander N. Sørnes

Feb. 3, 2009

Re: Fixing AppDB once and for all

by Zachary Goldberg

2009/2/3 Sparr <sparr0(a)gmail.com>: > On Tue, Feb 3, 2009 at 4:12 PM, Louis Lenders > <xerox_xerox2000(a)yahoo.co.uk> wrote: >> Zachary Goldberg <zgold <at> bluesata.com> writes: >> I think this will be a very difficult if not impossible task to accomplish. >> If we talk about test results, it's the app maintainer that is responsible >> for the correctness of the ratings and test results. What would you want to >> do if you think that the ratings for application X are overestimated? >> Remove the maintainer from the application entry in appdb? >> Then you'd have to check yourself for every app, if ratings are correct. > > These problems could be mitigated by making it easier to submit test > results. Even something as simple as a 5-star "how well does it work > for you" system that any registered user can submit with a single > click. Yes, the information we get will be less specific, but we will > get a *LOT* more of it. I would rather know that 1740 people have > gotten a game to work and 400 haven't (and no other information than > that) than to see just just five detailed test results saying > gold/gold/silver/silver/garbage. > > > As I mentioned previously this thread's purpose is not to decide how this is to be done. Thats what the IRC meeting is for. We can go on and on about how its best to be done over wine-devel but unless the people who have a stake in the matter and the ability to do it sit down and make some hard decisions the talk won't result in action.

Feb. 3, 2009

Re: Fixing AppDB once and for all

by Sparr

On Tue, Feb 3, 2009 at 4:12 PM, Louis Lenders <xerox_xerox2000(a)yahoo.co.uk> wrote: > Zachary Goldberg <zgold <at> bluesata.com> writes: > I think this will be a very difficult if not impossible task to accomplish. > If we talk about test results, it's the app maintainer that is responsible > for the correctness of the ratings and test results. What would you want to > do if you think that the ratings for application X are overestimated? > Remove the maintainer from the application entry in appdb? > Then you'd have to check yourself for every app, if ratings are correct. These problems could be mitigated by making it easier to submit test results. Even something as simple as a 5-star "how well does it work for you" system that any registered user can submit with a single click. Yes, the information we get will be less specific, but we will get a *LOT* more of it. I would rather know that 1740 people have gotten a game to work and 400 haven't (and no other information than that) than to see just just five detailed test results saying gold/gold/silver/silver/garbage.

Feb. 3, 2009

Re: Fixing AppDB once and for all

by Louis Lenders

Zachary Goldberg <zgold <at> bluesata.com> writes: > > All, > > So it seems to be almost every other day now when somebody mentions > how broken the appdb rating system is. This "broken-ness" has had > several high level discussions on Wine-Devel. There have also been > many, many proposed solutions to this problem. > > I do not wish to discuss these problems or these solutions in this > thread. It is time something was done about this. By done I mean > agreed upon (probably the harder part) then implemented in code and > published to the winehq server(s). > > I'de like to arrange an IRC discussion for all those interested in > finalizing an attack plan, and then assigning the responsibility of > doing it to somebody who is capable and has the time (perhaps myself). > > Lets (arbitrarily) set a time for the chat at: > > When: 11PM UTC (6PM EST) 2/6/09 (Friday) > Where: #winehackers > I think this will be a very difficult if not impossible task to accomplish. If we talk about test results, it's the app maintainer that is responsible for the correctness of the ratings and test results. What would you want to do if you think that the ratings for application X are overestimated? Remove the maintainer from the application entry in appdb? Then you'd have to check yourself for every app, if ratings are correct. BTW, also the opposite occurs very frequently: applications that are rated too low (garbage) whereas they are probably bronze or higher. When users send in garbage test results, i'm always tempted to try out the app myself if it has free download. In many cases it appears the application needs additional packages like mdac, vbrun or anything. Also many garbage results come from installing in a busted wineprefix ( just do a winetricks dcom98, and you'll get garbage results for apps in many cases), and they run just fine in a new ~/.wine So if someone shouts: "Hey, the app is rated gold, but for me it crashes" it's not necessarily the "gold-rater" who's wrong. My conclusion really is, it's very difficult to get the ratings correct, but always worth a try of course. What's more important is I think , that the appdb is rich source of info on how to get application X or Y running. Regards So my conclusion is it will be very difficult to get

Feb. 3, 2009

Re: Fixing AppDB once and for all

by Detlef Riekenberg

On Di, 2009-02-03 at 12:19 -0700, James Mckenzie wrote: > What I feel is necessary at this point is to collect who lives in what > time zone so that we incovience as few people as possible. I added a TZ column long ago, when the developer list was on the Fontpage. The infos are now here: http://wiki.winehq.org/WhosWho -- By by ... Detlef

Feb. 3, 2009

Re: Fixing AppDB once and for all

by Zachary Goldberg

2009/2/3 James Mckenzie <jjmckenzie51(a)earthlink.net>: > This would be too early for people on the West Coast of the United States by about three hours. > > No time will be satisfactory for all people who work on this project. > > What I feel is necessary at this point is to collect who lives in what time zone so that we incovience as few people as possible. > > Since this would be Saturday in Asia, this time may work for the majority of the people on this list. > > Also, will there be a transcript of the discussion and where will it be placed since this has a major impact on the functionality of the Applications Database. > > James McKenzie > > I have made a wiki on winehq with an agenda which will be updated with the results (and maybe transcript?) of the conversation. http://wiki.winehq.org/AppDBUpgrades

Feb. 3, 2009

Re: Fixing AppDB once and for all

by James Mckenzie

Zachary Goldberg <zgold(a)bluesata.com> >Sent: Feb 3, 2009 10:44 AM >To: Wine Devel <wine-devel(a)winehq.org> >Cc: Jeremy Newman <jnewman(a)codeweavers.com> >Subject: Fixing AppDB once and for all > >All, >Lets (arbitrarily) set a time for the chat at: > >When: 11PM UTC (6PM EST) 2/6/09 (Friday) >Where: #winehackers > This would be too early for people on the West Coast of the United States by about three hours. No time will be satisfactory for all people who work on this project. What I feel is necessary at this point is to collect who lives in what time zone so that we incovience as few people as possible. Since this would be Saturday in Asia, this time may work for the majority of the people on this list. Also, will there be a transcript of the discussion and where will it be placed since this has a major impact on the functionality of the Applications Database. James McKenzie

Feb. 3, 2009

Re: advapi32: add Security Label sids used by IE7

by Aric Stewart

yes as far as i can tell there was not an Untrusted label that is defined like the others. I included it in winnt.h for completeness. -aric Paul Vriens wrote: > Aric Stewart wrote: >> --- >> dlls/advapi32/security.c | 4 ++++ >> include/winnt.h | 16 +++++++++++++++- >> 2 files changed, 19 insertions(+), 1 deletions(-) >> >> >> >> ------------------------------------------------------------------------ >> >> > You added WinUntrustedLabelSid to winnt.h but not to security.c. Is that > correct? >

Feb. 3, 2009

Re: advapi32: add Security Label sids used by IE7

by Paul Vriens

Aric Stewart wrote: > --- > dlls/advapi32/security.c | 4 ++++ > include/winnt.h | 16 +++++++++++++++- > 2 files changed, 19 insertions(+), 1 deletions(-) > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > You added WinUntrustedLabelSid to winnt.h but not to security.c. Is that correct? -- Cheers, Paul.

Feb. 3, 2009

Re: kernel32/tests: Add a CreateMutex test. (Win9X todo)

by Florian Tobias Schandinat

Dmitry Timoshkov schrieb: > "Florian Tobias Schandinat" <FlorianSchandinat(a)gmx.de> wrote: > >> this test shows a difference between Win9X and NT. (tested on Win98SE >> and WinXP) Some apps expect the Win9X behaviour to work. I don't know >> what's the right way to fix it. Any advice or patch is welcome. > > How do that apps work under NT based Windows versions like XP or Vista? > I have to admit, that I expected it to not work on XP like a bunch of other applications I have. Tried it today and saw that it worked. (that XP machine isn't mine, so testing is a bit difficult) To summarize, this is not preventing at least this App from working at this point.

Feb. 3, 2009